Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

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Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Andrew on Sat Jul 26, 2014 12:52 pm

While in CO, we rented a Rubicon...the wife loved it. Smooth ride, fully capable, and we packed 10 people in a 2 door to get to the top of Yankee Boy Basin  Shocked.

She doesn't like the rough ride of the 4Runner on the trails after experiencing full-coil suspension. So...she's kind of pushing me to "upgrade" to a Rubicon. I just can't get myself to buy a J**p. We already have the truck that seats 6, and on most family outings we'll take that. We're just looking for something smaller than Kallin and I can use when it's just the 2 of us, but is still capable enough to get through Moab when we go with her family (and our future UtahT4R trips!). Less than 6 seats is OK.

It finally occurred to me that Toyota does have something similar...an FJ Cruiser. Anyone have experience with these? I hear they have plenty of power, aftermarket support (OME/ARB), and some even came with a rear locker. The v6 will be a nice fuel saver over my 14MPG truck. I'm thinking OME lift, armor, rear locker, 33's...should get me through pretty much everything! They make a front locker, but I don't need it. Brady has convinced me that driver skill alone, gets you through most trails (Kane Creek!!!!). Our whole trip through Moab, I only used my front locker once...and I didn't even need to use it then. My truck made it through Hell's Revenge (sure, I took some of the "easier" obstacles...but that's OK).

Thoughts? Can I save my dignity and be happy with an FJ Cruiser?????

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Kevin on Sat Jul 26, 2014 1:18 pm

I'd drive one before you get too hung up on the idea.  They say the visibility is poor and the rear seat is like a cave.  

Dare I suggest a link suspension for your beast, or are you over the idea of putting any more money into it?  4wheelunderground.com makes some nice kits that are supposed to be very pavement friendly...

Or better yet, get HER the FJ and keep the beast and make her come wheeling with us. I could get Nicole to bring her truck out more if she wasn't the only woman driving, I think.

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by offroad_medic on Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:35 pm

FJC's are a pretty capable rig even stockish. I agree with Kevin that the visibility is poor as can be. They do have plenty of aftermarket goodies to play with as well.

And if for no other reason it gives you an excuse to go to ouray for the FJ summit every year! Laughing 
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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by dutchman on Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:17 am

Andrew wrote: Brady has convinced me that driver skill alone, gets you through most trails (Kane Creek!!!!).

 cheers










.......I had good spotters.

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Ty wrote:The rear end is super easy  I could do it my self while some others do the front end.
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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by dutchman on Tue Jul 29, 2014 1:55 pm

Have you driven an FJ? What about getting a 3rd gen 4runner?

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Ty wrote:The rear end is super easy  I could do it my self while some others do the front end.
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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Andrew on Tue Jul 29, 2014 6:36 pm

Unfortunately I am coming to the realization that Toyota doesn't offer any modern, capable crawlers. I want a factory linked setup that can easily fit 35's and maybe even 37's. Only way to do that is SAS and all custom suspension. It takes way to much $$$ to turn a Toyota into a semi-serious crawler and still make it ride nice on the road. I'm seriously considering an older Rubicon.

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Kevin on Wed Jul 30, 2014 7:50 am


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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by dutchman on Wed Jul 30, 2014 8:04 am

I think an older Rubicon would be a good choice given your requirements. Though, I'd love to see another SAS 3rd gen in the group.

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Ty wrote:The rear end is super easy  I could do it my self while some others do the front end.
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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Kevin on Wed Jul 30, 2014 8:08 am

dutchman wrote:I think an older Rubicon would be a good choice given your requirements.

Did you miss the part where he asked for help avoiding disaster?

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by dutchman on Wed Jul 30, 2014 8:16 am

Kevin wrote:Did you miss the part where he asked for help avoiding disaster?

I'm sorry, what?!

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Ty on Wed Jul 30, 2014 5:00 pm

Kevin wrote:
dutchman wrote:I think an older Rubicon would be a good choice given your requirements.

Did you miss the part where he asked for help avoiding disaster?

I hate to say it, but I think Brady is right. Given this company, my T4R in the shop, Kevin's T4R in the shop, Brads T4R just out of the shop, Brady's T4R t case problems back in the day. I don't know if we are the group to tell him not to buy a Jeep.

My uncle broke the output shaft on his jeep the same trip I did, his was a $40, 40 minute fix. I got lucky finding a $100 replacement case and its still in the shop.

My vote is for the older Rubicon. For his needs it just fits. But I also vote keep the beast!

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Kevin on Thu Jul 31, 2014 3:28 am

Bradys tcase was his fault for not exercising that center diff lock switch often enough. Brads HG was just one of those things, and your truck and mine are down because we're not smart enough to leave well enough alone. If I'd just rebuilt the 22RE I'd have been wheeling four months ago, and if you hadn't tried to be cool with those 37s your tcase would still be intact Very Happy. Anybody who mods a Jeep to the level you and I are taking our trucks is going to run into twice as much trouble.

Nah, for my money I think Andrew is just bored. He's got Sixstringsteveitis. The justification for a new rig is that his wife will like riding in it more, but he's already admitted that when his whole family comes they need the space in the Tundra anyway, and how often does she come wheeling with him and the kids don't? He doesn't want the Jeep for her, he wants the Jeep for him. Very Happy

Back before the disease took a firm hold, he had just enough of his faculties left to post a plea for help. He asked us, his club brothers, to not let him buy a Jeep. Now that he's completely taken leave of his senses it's our duty as club bros to grant his final wish as a right-thinking Toyota junky and bring him back to sanity, not enable this Jeep-buying crazy talk. It's what he wanted. It's the right thing to do.


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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Ty on Thu Jul 31, 2014 3:37 am

Kevin wrote:Back before the disease took a firm hold, he had just enough of his faculties left to post a plea for help.  He asked us, his club brothers, to not let him buy a Jeep.  Now that he's completely taken leave of his senses it's our duty as club bros to grant his final wish as a right-thinking Toyota junky and bring him back to sanity, not enable this Jeep-buying crazy talk.  It's what he wanted.  It's the right thing to do.

Good point. Don't do it Andrew!!!

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Andrew on Thu Jul 31, 2014 11:11 am

On pretty much all of our wheeling trips with my wife's family, the kids ride with Grandpa or one of the Uncles...so we don't need 6 seats for the whole family. I was hoping you guys knew of a modern Toyota that is as capable as a Rubicon because I sure as heck can't find one. We are going to look at a JKU Rubicon today. It's at a dealership in Bountiful. He has it listed well below retail...heck, it's actually listed for less than KBB private party value(which I know nobody uses around here, but still...).

I'm just tired of not going on trips because my 4runner won't make the drive and the truck is too big for the trail. I want to get something that will remove all excuses that I don't have a "good enough" rig for the trip. I want to be out on the trails exploring, and I'll do whatever it takes to make that happen. Even if it means driving a J**p!!!!  Evil or Very Mad 

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Kevin on Thu Jul 31, 2014 11:39 am

Stock for stock there's nothing on the market as capable as a Rubicon, obviously. But I still contend that if you took the money you'll spend on a Rubicon and invested it in your '87, you'll have a truck that's twice what that Rubicon is, in streetability and trail capability. I don't know what a used Rubicon goes for, $25,000 or more? Take your truck to Mitch at UFAB and say "here's $20,000 I'd like a linked suspension with coilovers please" and he'll say "ok here's $5000 thousand dollars back because I only need $15,000 now go buy a supercharged 5VZE." Can you imagine that truck? Dropped to 35s with a blown 5VZE on coilovers? That'd be a dream to drive, on dirt or pavement.

I hate to see you buy into a boxed solution like a Rubicon. It might be fun at first, but once the problems start in and it's nickel and diming you to death, you'll hate it. You'll wheel less because you won't trust it, and that would suck. There's a REASON we drive Toyotas, man. I really strongly urge you to take what you've got and make it what you want.

Besides, Jeeps go in back. Do you really want to eat Brady's dust every trip?

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Andrew on Thu Jul 31, 2014 12:30 pm

Brady is going to end up in my first gen...so I will gladly eat his dust.  Twisted Evil 

I've been fighting with this for 2 or 3 years now. If I had the time and skills to build my first gen the way I want, we wouldn't be having this discussion. So, I have to pay someone else to it. Now it doubles the money I have to spend. Even after dumping 15 g's into it, it's still an 88 4runner. I'd be into it 20k, and MIGHT be able to get 10k out of it. Rate of return on that investment...piss poor. Now...you are absolutely right, that after building it to my specs, there would be no reason to sell it. I agree 100%. As I drove it around, though, it would be in the back of my mind that I'm driving a money pit. The bigger concern, however, is convincing my wife it's a good idea. Actually, it's not even a concern. I've tried to convince her for 3 years now...no go. And really, I can't blame her. I think her logic prevails here.

All that said, I still haven't purchased anything...so...

BTW, great discussion so far...and thanks for taking the time to help me out.

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Kevin on Thu Jul 31, 2014 1:02 pm

Oh, just buy her some diamonds, that'll shut her up.   Twisted Evil 

You gotta do what you think is best, but I look at all the "what's wrong with my Jeep" threads on RME and I worry.  Promise me you'll talk to Josh (TRD270) first though - he sold his built '85 4Runner to buy a Rubicon*, and two years later he's sold the Rubicon and is back in a 1st gen 4Runner.  Very Happy

* edit - for exactly the same reasons, I might add

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by dutchman on Thu Jul 31, 2014 4:32 pm

Andrew wrote:Brady is going to end up in my first gen...so I will gladly eat his dust.   Twisted Evil 

I am?!?!

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Andrew on Thu Jul 31, 2014 6:23 pm

Well, I couldn't do it.  The Salesman gave it a good effort, but I walked away.  My wife was shocked...honestly, I kind of was too Smile.

The search continues...

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Andrew on Thu Jul 31, 2014 6:24 pm

dutchman wrote:
Andrew wrote:Brady is going to end up in my first gen...so I will gladly eat his dust.   Twisted Evil 

I am?!?!

Some Jedi you are... Wink 

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Kevin on Thu Jul 31, 2014 6:29 pm

Andrew wrote:Well, I couldn't do it.  The Salesman gave it a good effort, but I walked away.  My wife was shocked...honestly, I kind of was too Smile.

The search continues...
Laughing 

i mean

 Sad 

but i secretly mean

 cheers

Ok, back to business.  How much truck do you need?  I mean, was the Rubicon going to stay stock or were you going to build it?  I'm looking in my crystal ball and I'm wondering if I see a mildly built 4th gen in your future.






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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Kevin on Thu Jul 31, 2014 7:59 pm

Or I could just leave this here -


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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Andrew on Fri Aug 01, 2014 8:54 am

I need to go drive an FJ Cruiser. There's one in AF right by the gym so I'll stop by there today.

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by Andrew on Fri Aug 01, 2014 9:11 am

Kevin wrote:Ok, back to business.  How much truck do you need?  I mean, was the Rubicon going to stay stock or were you going to build it?

I was going to keep it stock for now and then mod it if we started running trails that required more clearance. I figured, at some point, it would sit on 35's.

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Re: Quick: Need help avoiding disaster!

Post by dutchman on Fri Aug 01, 2014 9:16 am

Some future events, clouded they are.


I like those 4th gens!

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